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Post by ateliertohka on Oct 1, 2016 13:13:17 GMT -5
I really doubt that would be the case, though. I don't know about Hebijo, but the Crimson Squad has been around since the very first game, and I think it's the more widely liked team (all 5 members ranked in the top 10 of the EV popularity poll). As Poog said, a game with no evil ninja -could- be interesting... but then some people, such as me, would want a game with no good ninjas. Perhaps a pair of games like the paired Pokèmon games, with one focusing on good ninjas, and the other on evil ninjas, could be an interesting idea? They need to have a game with actual ninja stuff. You cant do that with the formula they've been going on. So essentially a Gessen or Hebijo game and not a Hanzo/Crimson one. My main thing with the Versus games is that I'm not really that big a fan of either Yumi or Miyabi, and really prefer them as side characters, if I'm being perfectly honest. I don't dislike them, but I just like Hanzo and the Crimson Squad more. I just prefer the aesthetic of those characters.
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Post by leanmeanlovinmachine on Oct 1, 2016 14:11:08 GMT -5
They need to have a game with actual ninja stuff. You cant do that with the formula they've been going on. So essentially a Gessen or Hebijo game and not a Hanzo/Crimson one. My main thing with the Versus games is that I'm not really that big a fan of either Yumi or Miyabi, and really prefer them as side characters, if I'm being perfectly honest. I don't dislike them, but I just like Hanzo and the Crimson Squad more. I just prefer the aesthetic of those characters. They need to get rid of one though. Homura actively dissuaded Asuka from doing actual ninja stuff in deep crimson.
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Post by HikageIsBestGirl on Oct 1, 2016 14:56:22 GMT -5
on the subject of haruka's voice actress, she said that any continuing roles played by her will be played by substitutes. considering the outrage over not including gessen and neo-hebi in sk2 (despite the game's narrative not necessarily needing them,) i don't think it'd be a good idea to just outright take characters out. speaking of sk2, i don't really know why people are trying to incite console wars, and the constant "takaki isn't smart" talk is kind of disrespectful. i don't think it's wise to act as if you know what went wrong with sk2's launch because none of us have any actual facts, data, or knowledge of the spending habits of the japanese consumer outside of conjecture, and as far as i can tell, none of our livelihoods depend on keeping track of these things. there are lots of factors to consider, but i don't think this is the thread where we should be discussing this, especially when some clearly have an agenda. as far as i can foretell, this game will be a nice little spin off ala bon appetit. i don't foresee any serious scenarios coming out of a game featuring water guns in this fashion. as has been stated, it's something takaki talked about last year, and when he talks about things this way, he tends to stick to his word. i don't think it was explained if the girls ever got off the island (i missed out on the ending dlc because i own the vita version) but i would imagine that this game would start off after said ending dlc, or something. it's hard to say with a series that now has a confirmed multiverse.
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Post by mongi291 on Oct 1, 2016 15:03:23 GMT -5
My main thing with the Versus games is that I'm not really that big a fan of either Yumi or Miyabi, and really prefer them as side characters, if I'm being perfectly honest. I don't dislike them, but I just like Hanzo and the Crimson Squad more. I just prefer the aesthetic of those characters. They need to get rid of one though. Homura actively dissuaded Asuka from doing actual ninja stuff in deep crimson. No, that's wrong. Homura didn't dissuade Asuka from doing ninja stuff, she wanted her to realize that blindly following orders, while it may be a shinobi's job, isn't always the right thing to do. That's a pretty good moral, if you ask me. Senran Kagura places on the idealistic end of sliding scale of idealism versus cynicism, with the characters that would rather work together and do what they believe is right, rather than just doing what is asked of them. To remove this kind of reasoning from the games would be to go against what the series has been like so far. also if you think that the crimson squad is going away just because it's not ninja-y enough you're being delusional lol
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Post by leanmeanlovinmachine on Oct 1, 2016 15:17:26 GMT -5
They need to get rid of one though. Homura actively dissuaded Asuka from doing actual ninja stuff in deep crimson. No, that's wrong. Homura didn't dissuade Asuka from doing ninja stuff, she wanted her to realize that blindly following orders, while it may be a shinobi's job, isn't always the right thing to do. That's a pretty good moral, if you ask me. Senran Kagura places on the idealistic end of sliding scale of idealism versus cynicism, with the characters that would rather work together and do what they believe is right, rather than just doing what is asked of them. To remove this kind of reasoning from the games would be to go against what the series has been like so far. also if you think that the crimson squad is going away just because it's not ninja-y enough you're being delusional lol Like it or not, you're agreeing with me. Even I dont think Takaki is deluded enough to think another Hanzo/Crimson game is a good idea. I'd like actual ninja stuff, thank you. I checked the anniversary website again and I still think that no Homura or Miyabi in the background is a hint.
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Post by mongi291 on Oct 1, 2016 15:25:14 GMT -5
No, that's wrong. Homura didn't dissuade Asuka from doing ninja stuff, she wanted her to realize that blindly following orders, while it may be a shinobi's job, isn't always the right thing to do. That's a pretty good moral, if you ask me. Senran Kagura places on the idealistic end of sliding scale of idealism versus cynicism, with the characters that would rather work together and do what they believe is right, rather than just doing what is asked of them. To remove this kind of reasoning from the games would be to go against what the series has been like so far. also if you think that the crimson squad is going away just because it's not ninja-y enough you're being delusional lol Like it or not, you're agreeing with me. Even I dont think Takaki is deluded enough to think another Hanzo/Crimson game is a good idea. I'd like actual ninja stuff, thank you. I checked the anniversary website again and I still think that no Homura or Miyabi in the background is a hint. No, I haven't agreed with you in the slightest. Mine may have been a poor word choice, but when I said that the Crimson Squad wasn't ninja-y enough I was being sarcastic.
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Post by Ayacchi on Oct 1, 2016 15:28:28 GMT -5
I don't think that really means anything lol Honestly, I notice that you guys tend to over assume stuff that you see. I don't think Takaki would do something as silly as remove the evil schools from the new game. Especially the Crimson squad considering how popular they are in Japan and Yomi especially when you don't include Yumi as the popular senran.
Just because they aren't included in a background for a teaser site doesn't mean that they will abandon them. As I said, that would be silly.
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Post by leanmeanlovinmachine on Oct 1, 2016 15:34:56 GMT -5
I don't think that really means anything lol Honestly, I notice that you guys tend to over assume stuff that you see. I don't think Takaki would do something as silly as remove the evil schools from the new game. Especially the Crimson squad considering how popular they are in Japan and Yomi especially when you don't include Yumi as the popular senran. Just because they aren't included in a background for a teaser site doesn't mean that they will abandon them. As I said, that would be silly. I think it means something. Just because they arent in a game doesnt mean they are abandoned. I mean, if Takaki cared about popularity, Hanzo would be in the trash bin. I guess versus games forever is fine then.
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Post by HikageIsBestGirl on Oct 1, 2016 16:07:41 GMT -5
what exactly do you mean by "actual ninja stuff?" the girls are still students, not actual ninjas yet. for them to be doing such things, they need to have graduated by now, and only a handful of them will be graduating soon.
the point of "ninja stuff" is different depending on what you mean when you consider that for them to be doing ninja things, they're going to have to be doing their actual jobs...aka, acting as bodyguards/assassins. it's been explained that ninjas at the current time aren't used for much else besides political tools...unless you also consider that they're also fodder for the true reason of their continued existence, which is summoning yoma for the Kaguras to beat.
at that point, they've kind of already been doing ninja things. just not under the actual title of a full fledged ninja.
to add on...crimson doesn't really get to do official ninja work because they have no affiliation between good or evil. they exist as an independent force. they can do a lot of the dirty work that most other ninjas, good or evil, won't want to do. but in the meantime, they're stuck training, avoiding hebijo assassins, and trying to make the most of their lives. even though SK2 hinted that crimson were allowed back into hebijo, the events of that universe don't exactly apply to any other one. in which case, they still have a lot of work to do.
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Post by ateliertohka on Oct 1, 2016 16:48:29 GMT -5
My main thing with the Versus games is that I'm not really that big a fan of either Yumi or Miyabi, and really prefer them as side characters, if I'm being perfectly honest. I don't dislike them, but I just like Hanzo and the Crimson Squad more. I just prefer the aesthetic of those characters. They need to get rid of one though. Homura actively dissuaded Asuka from doing actual ninja stuff in deep crimson. I disagree. Omitting characters will only serve to alienate fans of said characters. That's not a good idea. I don't really think Homura dissuaded Asuka from doing actual ninja things. Moreover, she called into question the morality of following orders blindly. The general idea behind that scenario was morality. Just because someone in a position says to do something make it the right thing to do. This was made very clear in the storyline.
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Post by leanmeanlovinmachine on Oct 1, 2016 16:49:51 GMT -5
what exactly do you mean by "actual ninja stuff?" the girls are still students, not actual ninjas yet. for them to be doing such things, they need to have graduated by now, and only a handful of them will be graduating soon. the point of "ninja stuff" is different depending on what you mean when you consider that for them to be doing ninja things, they're going to have to be doing their actual jobs...aka, acting as bodyguards/assassins. it's been explained that ninjas at the current time aren't used for much else besides political tools...unless you also consider that they're also fodder for the true reason of their continued existence, which is summoning yoma for the Kaguras to beat. at that point, they've kind of already been doing ninja things. just not under the actual title of a full fledged ninja. to add on...crimson doesn't really get to do official ninja work because they have no affiliation between good or evil. they exist as an independent force. they can do a lot of the dirty work that most other ninjas, good or evil, won't want to do. but in the meantime, they're stuck training, avoiding hebijo assassins, and trying to make the most of their lives. even though SK2 hinted that crimson were allowed back into hebijo, the events of that universe don't exactly apply to any other one. in which case, they still have a lot of work to do. Doing missions. Having them graduate would be great. Youma are ok but they are really boring and should only serve as an occasional boss. I would rather not have Homura and her gang shoot down Asuka or anyone actually trying to do work.
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Post by leanmeanlovinmachine on Oct 1, 2016 16:50:46 GMT -5
They need to get rid of one though. Homura actively dissuaded Asuka from doing actual ninja stuff in deep crimson. I disagree. Omitting characters will only serve to alienate fans of said characters. That's not a good idea. I don't really think Homura dissuaded Asuka from doing actual ninja things. Moreover, she called into question the morality of following orders blindly. The general idea behind that scenario was morality. Just because someone in a position says to do something make it the right thing to do. This was made very clear in the storyline. Well, it's pretty clear SK2 Homura and Asuka do not know what being a ninja is and would rather not be one. It was very clear in the storyline. But that's the SK2 timeline which might not be visited again. But I'd rather not every game be a versus game.
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Post by ateliertohka on Oct 1, 2016 17:23:36 GMT -5
I disagree. Omitting characters will only serve to alienate fans of said characters. That's not a good idea. I don't really think Homura dissuaded Asuka from doing actual ninja things. Moreover, she called into question the morality of following orders blindly. The general idea behind that scenario was morality. Just because someone in a position says to do something make it the right thing to do. This was made very clear in the storyline. Well, it's pretty clear SK2 Homura and Asuka do not know what being a ninja is and would rather not be one. It was very clear in the storyline. But that's the SK2 timeline which might not be visited again. But I'd rather not every game be a versus game. Either way, I would rather not have the series without the characters that have been around from day one. These kinds of games are associated with their characters. Without them, the series loses its identity, and becomes neither here nor there in terms of how one would see it. It's not beneficial. We've seen this with Deep Crimson. At this point, none of the characters, whether from the 3DS games or the Versus games, are indispensible. It would be kind of like Street Fighter without Ryu and Ken.
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Post by Murasame on Oct 1, 2016 17:45:27 GMT -5
SK2 left enough open doors with it's storyline, I think that if a SK3 comes out it will follow up on SK2's story to SOME regard and not just say "oh that didn't happen" and move on.
Honestly, very little ninja-y stuff actually happens in the series as a whole anyways, it's mostly just haphazardly mentioned and then someone yells "ALRIGHT LET'S FIGHT NOW". If they were to delve too deep into the ninja side more seriously then they would run the risk of making the girls appear less 'innocent', which wouldn't go over well in one way or another. Plus, the plot is also limited in the fact that this group of pretty much all friends has to fight between each-other CONSTANTLY in order to satisfy the gameplay department. They can only play that 'this fight is for training with eachother/bonding moment!' card so many times before it becomes extremely noticeable that that's the only excuse they have. The only way to FIX that is to constantly have new characters to fight, but that ALSO limits them because of the 'choose your waifu' nature of the cast they realize that if they use one character they're stuck in the series FOREVER (or at least, they SHOULD know this by now, as I'm fairly certain that the main gripe with sk2 was that it didn't have the two other schools), and eventually you just have too many characters to work with and the game suddenly is forced to take a 'quantity over quality' stance because if they REMOVE a character somebody out there is gonna get pissed and it's gonna hit sales. And all because the writing department needed excuses for the gameplay!
As is why ninja stuff doesn't really happen too much in the series. The focus on characters over all else simply doesn't allow for a deep plot about assassinations and the like to actually happen because it goes against the innocent demeanor of the game. SK2's commercial failure (in Japan anyways, I haven't actually seen how it's fared in the west yet) is probably the final nail in the coffin for this as well, as that game had the darkest atmosphere in the series, and that, to a developer at least, COULD be seen as a reason as to why it didn't succeed. Their issue could be seen by them as, put bluntly, the game not being anime enough.
And I'm not really certain that the Japanese fanbase (the only fanbase that the developers can really listen to, mind) actually cares one lick about story anyways, so it could just be seen as a non-issue to them.
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Post by HikageIsBestGirl on Oct 1, 2016 18:00:17 GMT -5
one should also consider that these games are coming of age stories, though.
they all kinda deal with certain subjects rather than just being simple good vs evil commentaries. the first games deal with the good vs evil dynamic to begin with.
with sk2, it's not that "neither of them want to be ninjas". it's that they figured there were other, better ways of handling the yoma crisis that didn't require killing Kagura, because she never did anything wrong to begin with. it sets up that the top shinobi advisors are rather shady for not giving any clear reason as to why Kagura needed to die, and also that standards in the shinobi world needed to change. there's a reason Kiriya said he believed that the girls were capable of changing the way things worked in the shinobi world.
my memory of sk2's story is a little fuzzy, though. particularly when it comes to those advisors or whatever.
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